OK, let's do another one:
There are more Blacks in jail than college
Let's look at a 10 year span to see if the quote is really meaningful.
Lets say 10 people are in jail for that time.
For the start of the 10 year span, 4 people are in college. Let's assume they graduate in 4 years. After the 4 years, another 4 people enter college. They graduate in 4 years. At the 8 year point, 8 people have graduated. The next year another 4 enter college.
During that 10 years, 10 people have been in prison, 8 have graduated college, with another 4 on track to graduate. That amounts to 12 people.
That's a simple scenario. But, hopefully, it points out the problem with that comparison. A comparison first started by liberals, now taken up by conservatives.
Mindsets determine outcomes
True. But I refuse to ignore stupidity directed towards Blacks as I refuse to ignore stupidity coming from Blacks.
I agree, the comparison of the number of black men in college to the number of black men in prison is fundamentally flawed. Most people in college are of a certain age, usually 18-24, plus or minus one or two years. The age range of the U.S. prison population is far wider than that the college population. The critical piece that's missing in this comparison is adjustment for age. So the question should be: if age is controlled, what is the difference in the number of black males in prison vs college? The other method of comparison that might have some utility is to simly compare the number of black men ages 18-24 in prison to the number of black men in college.
Posted by: hvblogger at August 22, 2004 03:13 PMWhy do we let others define the scope of our inquiries? Comparing college and prison is like comparing apples and oranges: only valid if the subject is fruit salad and even there, I'm not familiar with many that feature both.
We have too many young men in our jails and prisons and too many of them in for things that are better addressed in other settings. Let's focus on those issues and see what we can collectively do to change the stats.
We have too few young men (and women) entering college (and leaving high school prepared for college and/or the workforce). We need to address those issues and see what we can do collectively to change the stats.
When someone steps to us with stupid stats, we need to slap them upside the head.
Posted by: Ward Bell at August 22, 2004 03:45 PMUnfortunately, this feature-poor system does not allow one to edit mistakes: previous post should read, "... and leaving highschool unprepared for college ...."
Posted by: Ward Bell at August 22, 2004 03:49 PMI think the comparison is a valid comparison if you can indicate that throughout history, this ratios has changed for the negative for example...
x year - 1/4 prison to college
y year - 1/2 prison to college
z year - 2/1 prison to college
Because as we used to say when in banking, it is a negative trend even if you say the population growth is constant throughout time, an say rate of blacks by percentage of population in college is held as your constant, then it directly indicates an increase in the total prison population by percentage of population...
Regardless...has anyone noticed no one is talking about the industrial prison complex, the privatization of prisons, and the market forces that make it important FOR PROFIT to keep blacks in prison?
www.dellgines.blogspot.com
While your ratios are closer to being correct, the low number of Blacks who attended college in the past would still not produce an accurate picture, I think.
the privatization of prisons, and the market forces that make it important FOR PROFIT to keep blacks in prison?
I haven't been able to figure this one out, maybe you can help out. What percentage of the national GDP does the "industrial prison complex" make up?
Posted by: EBrown at August 23, 2004 05:37 PMOh, and if the Blacks who are justly locked up would stop doing the knuckle headed stuff that got them locked up, the industrial prison complex would be a non-issue.
"Oh, and if the Blacks who are justly locked up would stop doing the knuckle headed stuff that got them locked up, the industrial prison complex would be a non-issue."
Trite,if we all loved each other there would be no war. If ifs were fifths we would all be drunk.
The prison population in general has grown tremendously with blacks making up an overlarge percentage based upon population. So the question is two fold, 1) why is the US prison population growing at tremendous rates & 2) why is the black percentage of the tremendous growth prison population drastically larger than other ethnicities.
In other words, what is the social context that drives "knucklehead" behavior and how do you eliminate it.
As to your question on the industrial prison complex, the percentage of the GDP is irrelevent. Now. Privatized prisons are based upon profit increase, if you have taken any finance class then you know the primary objective of corporation is to maximize shareholder value, meaning that for a privatized prison system to perform its function it needs a continuous and stable or growing work force, to perpetuate its existence, produce its products and create profit.
In this model, it is evident to see that the reduction threatens the viablility of the corporation and therefore the reduction of crime is the antithesis of the privatized prison system. It is purely a capitalistic issue.
www.dellgines.blogspot.com
IF certain behaviours (murder, theft, battery, drugs, etc.) were not illegal there wouldn't be any need for prisons, public or private.
Funny how that works.
Posted by: BK at August 23, 2004 08:01 PMTrite
It's so trite that most Blacks behave in this way and most Blacks don't wind up spending time in jail.
Posted by: DarkStar at August 24, 2004 07:41 PM
Yes, that's clever, I guess. Surely, it's not news that stats can be twisted to infer just about anything you want, so I don't really get the point of this one. An ugly truth is an ugly truth, innit? We can question the truth of any statement (and/or its implications), but if it is "true" by some measure, it's what you do with that fact wot really counts.
A feeling, flaming liberal might wanna hop up and down to say, "Why is that?! We gotta do something about that! Let's make it easier for them to get in college!"
For others it might be a phenomenon that affirms a long-held belief that Black peoples is stoopid. If they was smart like us, the argument often goes, they'd figure out how to pull theyselves up by they own bootstraps. So, fuck em.
Mindsets determine outcomes.
Posted by: memer at August 22, 2004 10:56 AM